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Review of Cave of Forgotten Dreams Film Premier and live Q+A with Werner Herzog France

Submitted by Andy B on Wednesday, 23 March 2011  Page Views: 9210

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Grotte Chauvet
Grotte Chauvet submitted by Thorgrim : Cave lions - see review of Chauvet Cave (Vote or comment on this photo)
Andy B reviews Werner Herzog's film Cave of Forgotten Dreams. Chauvet Cave in Ardèche, southern France is considered to be one of the most significant prehistoric art sites and contains the earliest known cave paintings, as well as other evidence of Upper Paleolithic life. Discovered in 1994, it is located near Vallon-Pont-d'Arc on a limestone cliff above the former bed of the Ardèche River.

Only one film is being made inside the cave, due to its fragile nature and the need to protect it from damage such as the mould caused by too many people visiting Lascaux cave. Werner Herzog was fortunate to get permission, in preference to many French directors. He spoke about this in the Q&A afterwards, there was an agreement to make the film for a nominal fee, and it is copyright free for French educational establishments. Presumably he earns from international cinema showings such as last night's premiere. It also helped that the French minister of culture was a fan of his work.

Getting back to the film, my companions and myself found the 3D to be extremely effective and clear. We didn't experience the distracting 3D speckling complained of by one reviewer - apart from in one short dark segment.

Overall it was a serene affair, Herzog didn't whizz the camera apart from a couple of 'wake you up' sequences. The motion was generally very smooth and there were some clever shots over the water of the nearby river arch. I was left wondering how these were done until at the end of the film the remote control helicopter operator swung into view as part of a long fly-past. This was deliberate, the production process was part of the story and this was fine.

In the cave there were just four crew allowed including Herzog, all carrying battery powered LED light panels. The lighting, although limited was well done, with the lights gradually panned to reveal details of the art, and the sparkling calcite on the cave walls, which seemed at times to interact with the dark outlines of the animals. There were a couple of sequences attempting to simulate flaming torches, these didn't really work and I wondered whether the flickering electric LED candles that are now available could have been used to good effect.

The cave art is remarkable of course, and the 3D does exactly what is expected, allowing you to appreciate the shape and form of the surfaces and how they interact with the paintings. Many of the animals were drawn in multiple poses, suggesting movement in a kind of proto-animation. Male and female animal heads seemed in some cases to be superimposed, either next to each other, or is there some suggestion of shape shifting or fluidity – this was discussed later in the film. The scientists and art historians are also beginning to work out a chronology for the overlapping images which is interesting.

We were taken on a flythrough of 3D points based on a complete laser scan of the cave. Impressive, but I would have liked to see a bit more of this, perhaps showing where the paintings are in the cave.

The crew managed to film in some very inaccessible locations, including putting a small camera out on a long pole to view what is painted around a big stalagmite or 'rock pendant', thought to be a plump female torso overlaid with a bison. This is the only human representation in the cave and led on to a discussion of 'Venus' statuettes, with the 3D being used well to show a big collection from a museum in Germany, some of which were new to me. I wasn't able to catch the names of any of the museums or scientists shown as the captions were very quick and it's very difficult to write in the dark wearing 3D glasses! I'll research and add some of this information shortly.

There were insightful interviews, with one mustachioed archaeologist making more 3D spectacle by launching a quite sophisticated spear with a spear thrower. (Bow and arrow had yet to be invented.)

Hearing of the plan to recreate the cave in its entirety as part of a theme park, complete with smells, Herzog searched out a slightly eccentric master perfumier who said one of his pastimes was to try and 'sniff out' the locations of undiscovered caves by their unique smell. Whether this was successful seemed somewhat doubtful – Herzog later told in the Q&A that he didn't think the cave smelled of anything much at all.

We weren't able to see everything due to the limitation of staying on the metal walkways, but not only is there cave art, the floors of the cave are littered with large animal bones and skulls. Some of these have calcified into strange stalagmites. There are also fresh looking footprints and some extraordinary rippling formations on the floor. We were shown an area of the cave where ancient people had rubbed flaming sticks, presumably to rekindle them, here they managed to get a radiocarbon date of 28,500 years ago.

Herzog has a reputation for an idiosyncratic approach to structure and commentary, which seems well loved by his followers – the audience seemed mainly composed of film buffs rather than prehistory enthusiasts. However he was thoughtful enough to allow space for the original art to make its impression on you on without imposing his own ideas.

The time was well used with long slow pans of the rock surfaces, accompanied by sparse modern music with multiple voices and stringed instruments in complex harmonies. The length of these sequences served to get you in a relaxed and almost floaty and insightful state of mind, the music and panning images building in intensity, then we were jolted outside to the bright sunlight for a rather pointless concluding interview with the spear-throwing mistouchey bloke from earlier. I felt the end should have carried on building the with the pans around the walls and the music crescendo, then gently introduce the credits and you'd feel thoroughly satisfied and end on much more of a 'wow'.

There was a strange postscript which other film reviewers seem to focus on, where he muses about some albino crocodiles he found in a nearby jungle park. They made a fun subject for the 3D but it amounted to a little Herzogian distraction tacked on the end and nothing more.

Finally we were whisked via live link to the Ritzy Theatre in Brixton for the interview with Werner Herzog. He explained how he first got interested in cave paintings as a boy, earning his own money to buy an expensive book on the subject. He talked of his approach to documentary making, where he likes to be 'ice cold, like a surgeon' in his approach, and yet to tell stories rather than just pile fact on fact. He is demanding of his interviewees but feels he has a knack of a careful listening approach that extracts the most out his subjects.

The questions from the audience were good and my question was answered: no he didn't dream of the cave while making the film. He says he doesn't seem to have dreams at all. However one of the archaeologists interviewed in the film did talk of dreams, and feeling quite overwhelmed with being in the cave, needing several days outside again to 'absorb' the experiences. Other cave visitors also spoke of feeling watched and overlooked in some parts of the cave in quite a profound and creepy way.

With the History Channel and More 4 involved Cave of Forgotten Dreams will presumably by on the TV in 2D in the not too distant future, so perhaps wait for that if you can't get to the full 3D experience. The producers no doubt have an eye on possibilities for 3D TV but that's something for another day. Well worth finding in 3D if you can.

Review by Andy Burnham of the Megalithic Portal - you are welcome to reproduce of this review as long as you include this credit and a link back to this page.

There is more about the film on our main page for Chauvet Cave.

Note: An exclusive report from Tuesday night's film premier

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Cave of Forgotten Dreams showing at Rollright Trust 20th Anniversary Celebration by Andy B on Sunday, 04 June 2017
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Rollright Trust 20th Anniversary

THE ROLLRIGHT TRUST & THE NATIONAL FESTIVAL OF ARCHAEOLOGY COMBINED CELEBRATORY EVENT.

SATURDAY 15th JULY - THE THEATRE, CHIPPING NORTON 11AM - 10PM

Join us on Saturday 15th of July at The Theatre Chipping Norton for an event to celebrate not only the start of the National Festival of Archaeology but also the 20th year of operation of the Rollright Trust, guardians of the Rollright Stone monuments.

The day will include archaeological exhibits, activities and demonstrations. Professional archaeologists including Finds Liason Officer Anni Byard and Prof. Timothy Darvill, will be presenting talks to include the latest updates on the recent Saxon Lady skeleton and grave goods find, Cotswolds Megaliths, Chastleton House and other topics.

During the day storytelling will be taking place as well as hands on demonstrations. The day will finish with a showing of the Werner Hertzog documentary ‘Cave of Forgotten Dreams’ which fittingly blends the 2 disciplines of archaeology and art.

We have events suitable for all ages. All events are free but booking is essential for talks in the auditorium - contact the Box Office 01608 642350.

The programme is currently subject to additions and updates so for the latest news, please visit;
http://www.rollrightstones.co.uk
http://www.archaeologyfestival.org.uk/events/2800
[email protected]
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Cave of Forgotten Dreams showing on 24th Feb as part of Brighton Science Festival by Andy B on Friday, 08 February 2013
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Cave of Forgotten Dreams - Legendary director Werner Herzog was fortunate enough to document the interior of the Chauvet Cave in southern France, home of the world’s oldest known cave paintings. With 3D video technology, the cave and the astounding artwork are brought to the screen in a mesmerizing and unforgettable experience.

Sunday 24th February, 2pm Duke’s At Komedia, 44-47 Gardner Street, Brighton
Tickets from £7 to £9 on the door, or at from The Duke of Yorks. Suitable for all ages.

http://www.brightonscience.com/2013/category/24th-cave-of-forgotten-dreams/

http://www.picturehouses.co.uk/cinema/Dukes_At_Komedia/
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Cave of Forgotten Dreams by Werner Herzog by TheCaptain on Wednesday, 30 March 2011
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Just been to see this film this afternoon. Its fabulous, and was closer than I imagined possible to actually being in the cave to see the paintings and rock formations at first hand. Something not possible fo us mere normals at Chauvet.

I am not much of one for gimmicks, and was very wary of the 3D bit beforehand, but once in the cave, the 3D effects totally made this film brilliant. As is usual for these ancient rock art pictures, much of the full animal effect is made by the shape of the rocks, something which never shows in 2D flat pictures, but here in 3D, with the camera slowly moving, theheads of the animals can actually stand out, and things behind them appear as you move around.

And some lovely touches with the various interviews mixed in amongst the film.

Fabulous. Best £4 I have spent in a long time.
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Re: Review of Cave of Forgotten Dreams Film Premier and live Q&A with Werner Herzog by prismyd on Tuesday, 29 March 2011
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just found out by chance, from a friend that this is on at the ritzy in brixton :) (i hadn't read all of the article here at that time)... hoping to be able to get there to see it in the next couple of days or so...
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    Re: Review of Cave of Forgotten Dreams Film Premier and live Q&A with Werner Herzog by Andy B on Tuesday, 29 March 2011
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    Hello, the Ritzy in Brixton is where Herzog was on stage for the live Q&A, pity you missed that but I hope you enjoy the film.
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      Re: Review of Cave of Forgotten Dreams Film Premier and live Q&A with Werner Herzog by prismyd on Thursday, 12 July 2018
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      i know it's been seven years but thought i'd let you know... seen the film at last :) bought a copy... beautifully filmed.
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Re: Review of Cave of Forgotten Dreams Film Premier and live Q&A with Werner Herzog by Runemage on Thursday, 24 March 2011
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A big thank-you Andy from those of us who couldn't make the limited screenings. Hope they bring out a 3D DVD, if not, it still sounds more than interesting enough to watch in 2D.

In the blurb for the film it said the paintings became more bizarre the deeper into the cave people went and the theory of gases that induced hallucinations was forwarded to explain that. Was any mention made of the film crew having to have a clean air supply? Very good question about the dreams and some intriguing answers.



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    Re: Review of Cave of Forgotten Dreams Film Premier and live Q&A with Werner Herzog by Andy B on Thursday, 24 March 2011
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    I don't remember that being mentioned about the paintings but they did say they were only allowed in one area for a fairly short period due to the carbon dioxide seeping down from tree roots above. So lack of oxygen more than anything.
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      Re: Review of Cave of Forgotten Dreams Film Premier and live Q&A with Werner Herzog by Anonymous on Monday, 09 May 2011
      I thought it was that the CO2 from their breath would alter the pH of the air and cause damage to the paintings, hence the only being allowed into one area for a limited amount of time.
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        Re: Review of Cave of Forgotten Dreams Film Premier and live Q&A with Werner Herzog by Runemage on Tuesday, 10 May 2011
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        No, that wasn't the only issue with CO2.
        Quote from Herzhog http://www.archaeology.org/1103/features/werner_herzog_chauvet_cave_forgotten_dreams.html
        "We had a fairly brief period of time to film. When the researchers left in early April, I had the cave practically undisturbed for filming, but only for six days, and only four hours each day. Of course, later in the season the carbon dioxide level in the branch of the cave where you have the Panel of the Lions becomes dangerously high. In other parts of the cave there is a fairly high level of radon, and it has a cumulative effect on your lungs. So, we had to move around between toxic gases and radioactive gases."
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