[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Tuesday, 26 June 2007 | My partner and I agree. We were in the outer ring of stones, having got there at 8:30pm - and we were tripped over, propositioned, and generally devastated to see the way this sacred site was being treated. ...and that trumpeter playing "Away in a Manger"....and the theme to "Rocky"....PLEASE NO MORE !!! Have respect for people's faith. Ban the party animals and have a ticket-only event for those who are genuine Pagan. ESPECIALLY in the inner and outer circle of stones.....and LIMIT the numbers allowed into the stones themselves to the ticketed few.
We am heartily sorry you and your daughter were treated in this way. Believe me, not all us Britons are the same. I apologise on behalf of the whole of this ancient land, my forefathers and those to come. |
[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Tuesday, 26 June 2007 | Hahaha you sound like a christian ! save stonehenge solstice for the ticketed pagan few ! ? ! yeh right !
perhaps you shouldn't have bothered attending the celebration if the sight of people enjoying themselves is such a problem for you |
[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Wednesday, 27 June 2007 | How dare you insult me.
I am Pagan, not christian. Litha is sacred to me. So are the Stones of Stonehenge. Thankfully for you I can rise above comments like these. Frankly I don't think you can care about anything or anyone but your selfish little ego. I hope one day you see the errors of your ways and start to care more for the sanctity of spirit than you do now and start to respect the faith of others even if you do not share our views.
Note - the people who built this amazing temple (yes, it IS a temple and therefore holy space to many people) had more spirit and reverence than you. (and more B lls too). |
[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Wednesday, 27 June 2007 | hehehe - no change in your tone then ! what an authority complex ! seems i have the pagan faithful spitting feathers at the mere suggestion that everyone has exactly the same right as everyone else to celebrate the solstice at this ancient site.
Project what you like onto the place. Why you have decided to attack me personally is beyond me. From where i'm standing, stonehenge has nothing to do with faith or religeon.
|
[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Wednesday, 27 June 2007 | Actually, I believe that everyone should join in the celebration. The turning of the wheel of the year affects everyone and so everyone should feel free to celebrate the shortest night of the year.
The problems come when that celebration becomes a disgusting free-for-all. That's when certain sections of those in attendance prove they can't be trusted, and that is when people start looking for ways to prevent the untrustworthy sections from causing more harm.
Nobody should have to tolerate the desecration of part of our nation's heritage - even if you can't see the religious significance, you must be able to see that the site is part of Britain's history. It has been nominated as one of the new 7 Wonders of the World, for goodness sake!
I know, let's go to the Kabba and throw up all over it. Or how about a little graffiti in the Pyramids? Let's go smoke a little pot in St Paul's Cathedral, or maybe go pee in the Ganges? If you don't want to travel too far, just go to your local church and eat dinner off the altar.
That's sarcasm, in case I've given any daft people any ideas. All anyone is really hoping for is a little common sense. And maybe some better-positioned rubbish bins.
Yes, sacred cows often make the best hamburgers (for the record, I'm vegetarian!), but just because a site has no religious significance to you personally doesn't mean that you shouldn't treat it with respect.
If anyone would like to learn about the religious significance of Stonehenge, I have taken some time to dig through Google and have found a couple of easy-to-understand sites. Education is usually the best way to fight ignorance...
Stonehenge.co.uk - Ceremonial Use.
Stonehenge - Wikipedia - in particular: "Stonehenge is a place of pilgrimage for neo-druids and those following pagan or neo-pagan beliefs. The midsummer sunrise began attracting modern visitors in 1870s, with the first record of recreated Druidic practices dating to 1905 when the Ancient Order of Druids enacted a ceremony."
Earth Mysteries: Stonehenge and the Druids. A college student's essay. I must say, the ceremonies shown in some of those photos look a lot more peaceful than the near-riot I experienced this year.
And of course, there's a lot of theory about Stonehenge being the equivalent of a giant sundial, designed to tell people when the nights started getting shorter (you can imagine how vital this was in an age before clocks and calendars with half-naked bimbos on them)! This would have made Stonehenge a vital site in the telling of the year, and it is probable that the altar (yes, that was the big stone that some folks were jumping up and down on) was used for sacrifices, because that was just the way things were done back then. Christians used to do it too, y'know, just read the Bible!
And when the stones have been closed to the public for good, we'll know which people to blame, won't we?
Love and light,
Aeryn |
[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Wednesday, 27 June 2007 | From my point of view, the stonehenge solstice is a wonderful celebration, from yours it is a disgusting free for all.
I don't see any harm being offered to the site itself, for goodness sake, these rocks have been standing there for thousands of years, what difference is a bit of wee or vomit going to make ?
(although in my opinion both these bodily offerings can be highly spiritual in nature..) |
[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Wednesday, 27 June 2007 | Maybe you weren't actually crammed into the stone circle, or being asked for/offered drugs, being fallen over or groped. Maybe you weren't being insulted by someone you'd never met about your physical appearance or personal beliefs. If so, you were one of the lucky ones, and I wish my night had been similar.
If you were one of the lovely, peaceful people I saw sitting around on a blanket, sharing a pair of headphones with a friend or two and passing a bag of crisps around while having a giggle and a quiet slurp of wine out of a plastic bottle, then I have no beef with you. If you were one of the people surrounding me as I wiggled in to the centre to join in with their dancing, then wasn't it fun, and didn't those drummers keep going for a long time? Hey, join the party next year!
In case you didn't read the leaflet you were given with your plastic trash bag, the stones were not supposed to be stood on. Two of the stones have actually fallen over in the past from hordes of people actually climbing up to the top of the stones.
It is damaging in much the same way as climbing all over any structure is damaging. Ancient sites were not designed with today's people in mind... councils put restrictions on people clambering all over modern buildings, too.
As for bodily fluids, I was more trying to make the point of being disrespectful. Yep, vomit can be hosed off and some natural magick practitioners use urine in protection bottles... but that wasn't really the point. Spit can be washed off the face, but if I was to go up to someone and spit on them, I'd probably (and rightfully) be arrested for assault.
To people who view specific places such as Stonehenge to Pagans or the Kabba to Muslims, the structure is not just a bit of rock, and the kind of anti-social behaviour I witnessed from a group of people (who were probably only a small group... just quite a loud one) is seen as an assault on the site.
It's hard to explain to someone with no religious viewpoint!
Love and light,
Aeryn xxx |
[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Wednesday, 27 June 2007 | There are always going to be displayed what you describe as 'anti-social' attitudes at any such large gathering while social anonymity remains.
you get the same behaviour on any high street of any UK town on a weekend. alchohol is usually the catalyst.
Your original post was, although containing some elements of fact, in my opinion, sensationalist drivel.
Suggest you get on and enjoy the managed access for all.
not just you and your mates. |
[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Wednesday, 27 June 2007 | I am not actually the "original-original" poster, just someone who can sympathise with this woman and her daughter's bad experience.
You're entirely right, alcohol is the catalyst for so many people's stupid, selfish and immature behaviour everywhere. Yob culture is becoming too hard to fight, and it is very depressing for anyone with even a shred of decency left.
I reckon they're mostly kids, about 18-21, still learning their limits with alcohol and drugs and trying to find their feet. Don't worry, it happens to everyone, and I do realise that these kids celebrating their university graduation at Stonehenge will grow out of it.
My younger brother came home recently from a night out with his tooth snapped in half - an adult tooth that is not salvageable. Up until that happened, he was also like that: convinced that the binge-drinking, drug-taking, "this is normal and if you say anything different, you're a sad act" culture was right and normal.
I don't worry too much about the state of these kids. Because they will end up in ambulances and police cars, drug rehabilitation units and alcohol awareness courses, getting the shocks that will make them grow up.
But of course, Stonehenge isn't a high street. It isn't a nightclub. It is an ancient monument and you must realise that the only reason it is open to the public is because English Heritage were convinced that the public could be trusted with it.
I simply worry that eventually, English Heritage will look at what is going on and say "no more".
And then there will be no access for anyone. Not even you.
Bright Blessings,
Aeryn |
[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Tuesday, 26 June 2007 | If that's people's idea of enjoying themselves... well, I worry for my generation. I'm 20 and have more sense than some of my peers seem to have in their big toes.
Listen up, kids. The Solstice is a religious holiday, and there is no getting away from it. These people who see the access as a big frat party should go find a local nightclub and celebrate there. They can have all the alcohol and drugs they want and "enjoy" themselves until their livers give out!
Yes, I am being patronising and sarcastic for a reason. It's mostly childish behaviour, which I think might be on the same wavelength as the people who ruined my religious celebration.
Now, I'm going to switch off the computer and go read a nice book.
Bright Blessings,
Aeryn |
[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Tuesday, 26 June 2007 | Thank goodness I'm not the only one to vent my frustrations on the web! I think I'm hoping that if lots of us do it, someone might take notice. Wishful thinking, most likely.
I spent the whole night being tripped over by drunk people, overhearing the horrible comments you mentioned, putting up with some truly horrendous trumpet playing, idiots shouting and generally fearing for my safety. Being asked if I had any ketamine by a particularly dead-eyed teenage boy was, I think, the most memorable bit of the night after the fantastic opening ceremony (props to the team - excellent job at leading group ritual-phobic people like myself!).
Frankly, I gave up when the people who had slept in their cars overnight swarmed into the stone circle. They just kept on coming. I remember at one point muttering "Oh, gods, there's just more and more of them... surely the people in charge realise this is getting dangerous?" But no, there was no control over the flood of people trying to get in. I don't know how the Druid team managed to get back into the circle, but I didn't envy them at that point.
OK, if you've got kids with you, staying in the car is the best way to go about it. But these weren't careful parents with sleepy kids in tow - they were the drunk youths (OK, they're my age... but I'm old before my time) who had spent the night ruining things for the rest of us.
I actually left before sunrise, sick of being squashed and trampled on, unable to see anything over the crowd of people waving bottles of alcohol, unable to smell anything but weed and cigarette smoke.
I was never able to see the sun rise from in the circle, as I have waited to do for all those years. Instead, I left, unable to see properly through unshed tears, wading through ankle-deep rubbish.
I've been waiting 10 years to go to Stonehenge, since I saw it on TV aged 10. I was horribly, horribly disappointed and sickened to watch the sacred site turn into a open-air "dive" nightclub.
And I doubt I will go back until something is done about it.
My suggestions:
* No alcohol, no smoking. A cigarette is just as dangerous as any other sort of fire, and for asthmatics like myself, the smoke can be instantly deadly.
* Anyone found drunk and/or stoned should be escorted from the site, preferably into a police car. Or a big tank of cold water. Whichever is easiest.
* Put limits on numbers.
* Close the stone circle at some point (midnight might be ideal, or perhaps 1am to allow for food-eating and such). If you're not in the circle by then, tough noogies. Those who have got there early and are staying up all night as a religious vigil deserve to be in there. This may require a carefully-sited Portaloo for people staying there overnight.
* Better yet, have wristband access to the stone ring, given out from Pagan organisations for Pagans and their invited friends. Everyone else is welcome to come party outside, as long as they aren't being anti-social!
I will send a note to English Heritage, however I am not hoping for much.
Love and light,
Aeryn |
[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Wednesday, 27 June 2007 | beakerspeaker writes:
This diatribe is a copy and manipulation of a letter posted in the
North Wiltshire and Kennet Gazette and Herald on the 22/6/07 apart
from the last line
This year was even worse..and I have photo's and video footage as
proof.
http://www.gazetteandherald.co.uk/display.var.1491339.0.0.php#comment
s_form
No doubt this person has already sent her comments to EH as she did
last year and no doubt every newspaper in wilts not forgetting the
daily mail and Gordon Brown. She has every right to express her
opinion along with other similar confectioned articles from very
radical right wing sounding pagans or even mildly conservative ones
but she and they represent a small and as we see here overtly over
represented vocal minority of the overall evaluation and enjoyment
of the attendees at the open access 2007.
I support the pagans who wish to enjoy the solstice and respect them
for their tolerance and good spirit despite the stupid and
insensitive comments.
It´s not perfect but some of these views in these letters are
outrageous and close minded, fortunately the majority of the people
had a great time at the solstice.
All I can say is be wary of the this type of cut and paste
propoganda of a a small goup who are trying to hoist their own
agenda. This type of diatribe is likely to make the pagans prescence
at stonehenge even more difficult when we should be educating the
public and especially young people to comprehend and empathise with
the pagan point of view. These type of comments make it harder and
make pagans seem more ridiculous not less.
99% of comments, photos, videos that I have seen so far have been
favourable doesn´t surprise me that this has come up now. I would
not be making key points of this iffy material. But do what you
will.
You made some good responses Fee. Looking foward to reading the
minutes.
Peace and freedom and tolerance.
A pagan dream...... the festival is that way..............well on
those mats over there.......A young male raver goes sigh doesn´t
wash hari hari London bus...... we don´t want crumbs we want cake.
More information on amplified music would be helpful though! I did
see one incident where a ghetto blaster and owner were escorted off
the premises by EH Security. But wasn't aware of anything else.
Pathetic. Live music at stonehenge yes yes yes............ |
[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Thursday, 28 June 2007 | I suppose the reason some of it was cut-and-pasted was because the writer felt the behaviour this year was as abysmal as last. I agree. I was there and witnessed most of the same disrespectful and personal abusive comments and behaviour. (Aimed at my friends and me too).
The fact this kind of behaviour happens in any town on a Friday and Saturday night does not make it acceptable - ESPECIALLY in another faith's temple. (It IS a temple to the pagan faithful and therefore should not be desecrated).
Let us respect our heritage, other people's faiths and each other.
btw please don't call the views of others you happen to disagree with "propoganda"(sic). Propaganda is written with a view to political ends. They were just expressing their opinions, to which they are very entitled in a free democratic world that allows you to discuss important subjects dear to peoples' hearts like this.
Love-and-Light
btw urine and vomit contain acid that DOES erode rock structures over time. |
[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Thursday, 28 June 2007 | *shrugs lightly* I guess my naturally strong writing style is because I'm a professional writer/journalist! Hehe, a Pagan journalist, now there's something you don't see every day!
I actually have no political affiliation. At all. Which is also rare for a journalist, but there you go. To me, politics is just a load of rich men sitting around comparing nuke buttons. If anything, I am a paid-up member of the Let's Have Common Sense and Respect Each Other and the Environment party.
Well, technically I'm a soon-to-be journalism student, but I've done semi-pro in the past. I just took two years out of the education system... confused? You would be, if you were in my shoes!
I didn't know about the ghetto blaster thing, probably because I was stuffed up in about 1ft square of space inside the stones. Live music at the event would be great - they could put thick tents or something up around the area where the food thingies were. Lots of Celtic music and so forth. That might satisfy the kids and reduce the numbers of people trying to party on the monument itself.
The only information given on amplified music was on the Conditions of Entry pdf available to download from the English Heritage website a few weeks before was: None. None in the car park, none in the stone circle, none on any of the fields.
I agree, this should also have been written on the leaflet we were all given with the plastic bag.
Then again, the same was said of... if I can just find the leaflet... here it is (copied verbatim from the leaflet, including emphasis):
----------------------------------------------------
Respect
Stonehenge is seen by many as a sacred site - please respect it. Drunken, disorderly or anti social behaviour will not be tolerated - please respect each other.
----------------------------------------------------
Basically, all I see from those who were there simply to party hard is a desire to defend their rule-breaking. It's like a bunch of kids who won't admit they're in the wrong. And worse: they're my age. What happened for me to develop such a gap from these ravers? That, my sweets, is scary. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy a good party as much as anyone, and I love to go to my local nightclub and spend some time tearin' it up on the dancefloor, but for some reason I just can't see the Summer Solstice Access as a big open-air rave.
Was it just me, or did the stewards mysteriously vanish from the stone circle at 11pm? The behaviour was at the worst from between 11 and 3. Maybe if there had been a heavier security presence in the stone circle, problems would be reduced.
I sort of wish I'd taken video footage, too. Naturally (I am Murphy's Law personified) my dodgy camera battery had decided to blow up and I was relying on my mobile phone camera. Not good. Not good at all, which is why I have no photos of anything that went on that night.
Sigh, guess the students and the religious just have completely different motives and wishes on this one.
It's kind of sad, when you think about it.
Bright Blessings,
Aeryn |
[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Monday, 03 March 2008 | I am doing a reseach paper so I need eyewitness acounts good and bad for school 8th grade please reply
|
[ Reply to This ]
| Re: Stonehenge Summer Solstice Spiral Meditation by Anonymous on Thursday, 15 May 2008 | I know exactly how you feel. This was my first solstice at stonehenge and i was so disapointed i felt like crying. So many people were there just to party and get wasted. I saw people rolling around on the floor with coke all over their faces and people doing coke openly infront of stewards. There was so much drugs and alcohol there it ruins the sacredness of the event.
Some drunk guy also tried to start a fight with me because i have a pentacle tattooed on my back. he said "why have u got that pentangle you probably don't even know what it means!"
I'm just shocked this is what our contry is coming to. Decmating sacred events! |
[ Reply to This ]
|
We would like to know more about this location. Please feel free to add a brief description and any relevant information in your own language.
Wir möchten mehr über diese Stätte erfahren. Bitte zögern Sie nicht, eine kurze Beschreibung und relevante Informationen in Deutsch hinzuzufügen.
Nous aimerions en savoir encore un peu sur les lieux. S'il vous plaît n'hesitez pas à ajouter une courte description et tous les renseignements pertinents dans votre propre langue.
Quisieramos informarnos un poco más de las lugares. No dude en añadir una breve descripción y otros datos relevantes en su propio idioma.