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The Megalithic Portal and Megalith Map : Index >>
General Forum >> Atlantic Celts
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Atlantic Celts |
Thorgrim
Joined:
25-06-2003
Messages: 794
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|  Posted 21-08-2003 at 22:12
Anyone read the "Atlantic Celts" by Simon James (British Museum Press)? He demonstrates very convincingly that there never were any Ancient Celts in Britain or Ireland! Original Celts lived to the north of the Alps and spread to Po valley, but never came to Britain at all! The people of Wales, Ireland and Scotland are not ethnically Celtic and so called Celtic art and metalwork arrived through trade. Then Britons copied samples and evolved their own style. Gaelic, Erse and Welsh are not Celtic , but are developed from the language spoken in the Bronze Age. Bronze Age continuity of population as reflected by burial patterns, farming and domestic buildings argues against any continental Celtic invasion or migration. Seems that even Caesar said that the Britons were similar to, but different from the Gauls. Now seems to be the view held by majority of archaeologists. Will the term "Insular Iron Age" replace "Celtic" in British archaeology? Is the term "Celtic" now politically incorrect? Stirring stuff! 
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Andy B
Joined:
13-02-2001
Messages: 7001
from Surrey, UK
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|  Posted 25-08-2003 at 21:14
Fascinating stuff, thanks for posting. Sounds reasonable to me. It was an irritation with the all-pervasive Celtic patterns that spurred us to set up the Megalithic shop.
Cheers,
Andy
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Thorgrim
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|  Posted 25-08-2003 at 22:29
Further information is available at http://www.ares.u-net.com/celtindx.htm
I am almost totally convinced, but still find it emotionally hard to accept that the Irish, Welsh and Gaels are not Celts! Forget that name which was only applied to them in the 17th century. Forget that there is no evidence to link the people of pre-Roman Britain with the people of Hallstadt and La Tene. OK - but the non-English people of Britain, Ireland and Gaul surely had a common culture and similar language so is it all a question of labels? Fashion in history and archaeology is currently to minimize invasions, folk movement and large scale migration and that is what worries me about Simon James' extreme view. Call them what you like - the "Insular Iron Agers" if that is more acurate than Celtic, but it hasn't quite got the same ring. If he hadn't called his book "The Atlantic Celts" but "The Iron Age Islanders" - I wonder if it would have sold as well. 
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JohnLindsay
Joined:
28-02-2012
Messages: 116
from London
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| Posted 03-04-2012 at 11:55
I've read the Atlantic Celts now, following Cunliffe on between the oceans, and if I hadn't read the Cunliffe I don't think I would have got the coded message in James.
This is the same Simon James as the curator of gallery 50 in the British Museum, for which he wrote the catalogue, also published by BMP, when either he still believed in Celts, or the marketing department did.
He is raising some important arguments about the practice of museums in generating popular knowledge, perhaps what Mythologies would have called mass culture.
Barry Cunliffe I met during his tenure at the British Museum, along with Neil McGregor, so there is quite a bunch of people who seem to get along by being nice to one another. It is a really hard matter when you are engaged with people and their ideas.
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JohnLindsay
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28-02-2012
Messages: 116
from London
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| Posted 03-04-2012 at 11:59
the business about common culture and insular culture, of things developing by waves and things arising autonomously is a really interesting matter. The white gold, Hallstatt, pwllheli, stack I started in a post so it wouldn't be completely lost here, but this james table maps that one, along with Renfrew on Archaeology and language.
Childe produced some tables, and now I'm trying to track down any more sunstantial ones dealing with the matters of this field. Field of course is a really bad grep, for we could add David and Earthen Long barrows which is even more confusing and really does need some tables.
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