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Moderated by : Andy B , TimPrevett , coldrum , Klingon , MickM , TheCaptain , bat400 , davidmorgan , Runemage , SolarMegalith , sem
The Megalithic Portal and Megalith Map : Index >>
Stones Forum >> Archaeo-Astronomy
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Archaeo-Astronomy |
sem
Joined:
12-11-2003
Messages: 1710
from Bridgend,S.Wales
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|  Posted 15-02-2010 at 22:07
I recently attended a lecture by Mike Edmonds (professor in astro-physics) in Cardiiff University. The core of his talk revolved around how inaccurate sightings with the naked-eye are and thus make it very difficult for astronomers (and archaeologists) to prove if alignments to celestial events were intended. His best example was trying to "fix" the Solstices. For 5 days either side of the Solstice the sun's position moves by just one third of it's width, making accurate alignment extremely difficult. To add to this, up to 70% of sunrises on a clear day are not visible due to the "murk" (quote Jack Morris-Eyton).
Could it be that Solstice and Equinnox festivals were not fixed in stone? Is it possible that the celebrations were weather (and social) dependent?
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bat400
Joined:
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Messages: 1333
from South Central Indiana, US
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| Posted 15-02-2010 at 23:41
A very interesting question.
It seems to be that a lot of the alignments associated with solstices don't have to be "precise", they merely need to be "accurate" to indicate an intent on the part of the makers. If precision is impossible (let's say the "things" that are marking the alignment are large, like boulders, or even dressed plinths, an alignment within a few days of the event could still indicate intent.
There are proposed alignments in Chaco Canyon (Example: Fajada Butte) that some researchers speculate to be part of a "Revelatory" ceremony. A "watcher" anticipated the upcoming day when celebrants would observe the pre-aligned marker for the event.
I think the whole idea of intentional alignments gets dicey when the ancient site has so many physical "features" that an almost infinite set of astronomical alignments can be proposed for the multiple angles.
Example: Canada's "Stonehenge".
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sem
Joined:
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Messages: 1710
from Bridgend,S.Wales
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| Posted 21-02-2010 at 00:07
Hi Bat
An even simpler conundrum has not yet been resolved.
Does it align to the MidWinter Sunrise or the MidSummer Sunset?
And of course vice-versa, Midwinter Sunset etc.
Sem
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James
Joined:
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Messages: 80
from High Desert
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| Posted 21-02-2010 at 17:05
Greetings!
Out here in the Great Southwest Desert, the "Fixed Stones" are exact, for when they were illustrated.
In Chaco Canyon, the Kivas are aligned, the window in Casa Bonito is aligned, and I have seen these things myself, on the days of Solstice and Equinox.
We don`t know what the Ancients were thinking, and for someone to assert the "Solstice and Equinox" were their "Holy Days" is just so much wishing..........however, Data needs to be collected, ideas thrown around, and no viewpoint can be tossed without serious debate.
The Ancients were skilled. That much we know. The Ancient sites out here were oriented very, very close to what the modern dates are.........I have made very, very accurate sightings of the Sun, Moon, and Stars, with my naked oculars.
Marked them with Stone, I did.
A "buffer" of three days is what we use for our "Social" events on the Hinges of the Year..........Weather permitting.
/!\
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bat400
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from South Central Indiana, US
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| Posted 22-02-2010 at 04:18
Quote:
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On 2010-02-21 00:07, sem wrote:
Hi Bat
An even simpler conundrum has not yet been resolved.
Does it align to the MidWinter Sunrise or the MidSummer Sunset?
And of course vice-versa, Midwinter Sunset etc.
Sem |
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This might be deduced from the location. If a site with an obvious "MidWinter-MidSummer" alignment were located on a bluff with a clear view to the East, then you might deduce that the sunrise was the event of interest.
See this display in the Mounds State Park museum in Indiana:
http://www.megalithic.co.uk/modules.php?op=modload&name=a312&file=index&do=showpic&pid=25374&orderby=dateD
The two red lines show a supposed alignment to solstice sun sets. Sunsets are assumed only because the earthworks are sited on a bluff over looking White River (lying to the immediate west). If the trees were cleared the most dramatic sight lines would be to the west. This isn't absolutely proof that the event was the sunset, but it seems likely...
[ This message was edited by: bat400 on 2010-02-22 04:19 ]
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cerrig
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from Brecon Beacons
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| Posted 23-02-2010 at 06:26
Hello Sarah Burkster, are you new here.
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sem
Joined:
12-11-2003
Messages: 1710
from Bridgend,S.Wales
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| Posted 23-02-2010 at 21:58
James
Thanks for the info. The three day "buffer" appeals to me.
Bat
In "normal" mode I would agree with you, but I work with people with learning disabilities. They don't have a normal mode and this is one of the reasons I question simple ideas like alignments.
Maybe I'm just weird
Cheers
Sem
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