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cropredy
Joined:
01-01-2006
Messages: 5549
from Oxon
 OFF-Line
|  New Message Posted!2013-02-07 20:32
Quote:
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On 2013-02-06 22:35, Feanor wrote:
The Moon is made of Green Cheese.
The Earth is Flat.
Alien Hybrids built the Pyramids, with blood & cultural roots that go all the way back to Zeta Reticuli 500,000 years ago. (Ahh, the plaintive cry from home!)
The World actually Did end on 21 Dec and this is merely the inevitable hangover.
Atlantis was a real place.
I am a Gourmet Chef, and I have the peerless toasted cheese sandwich right here to prove it!
Ladies and Gentlemen - this is The Mysteries Forum. It concerns "Mysteries". We can (almost) say whatever we want because it's an Opinion.
I introduce a topic which invites forthcoming remarks. Some people will agree with me / others will want dot-to-dot elucidation. All very natural, and we should be prepared for this.
I will give you an undeniable, bomb-proof rationale why the Earth is flat.
Your job is to discuss why, in your Opinion, this is not the case.
Now we take this belief-item over to the Stones Forum and we'd better strap ourselves in - cuz it's gonna be a bumpy, bruising ride, with some clever, keen, and insightful reasons why your mother should never have swum out to that troopship.
Fair enough.
But in here it's already a given that this is an opinion, so why be redundant?
Anyway, that's my ...
Neil
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Applause.
The Earth is a local memory.
The moon is a memory betwixt the memory of earth and the sun.
We are by products of the earths memory, but influenced by the sun and moons.
All living memories have independance from the dominant memory they are within, but will eventually be assimilated.
We are akin to humming birds , in that our memory is ultra fast compared to the dominant earth memory we are within, but....
There are methods ..both modern and ancient to better interface with the memory of the planet.
All rock was once independent memory life, it is now super compressed to variant amounts.
The variance of rocks can be locally utilised to interface locally with the memory of the planet.
But first You need to fall down a great big wabbit hole and chase a white wabbit.
cropredy
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Feanor
Joined:
11-05-2011
Messages: 316
from Cape Cod Massachusetts, US
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2013-02-06 22:35
The Moon is made of Green Cheese.
The Earth is Flat.
Alien Hybrids built the Pyramids, with blood & cultural roots that go all the way back to Zeta Reticuli 500,000 years ago. (Ahh, the plaintive cry from home!)
The World actually Did end on 21 Dec and this is merely the inevitable hangover.
Atlantis was a real place.
I am a Gourmet Chef, and I have the peerless toasted cheese sandwich right here to prove it!
Ladies and Gentlemen - this is The Mysteries Forum. It concerns "Mysteries". We can (almost) say whatever we want because it's an Opinion.
I introduce a topic which invites forthcoming remarks. Some people will agree with me / others will want dot-to-dot elucidation. All very natural, and we should be prepared for this.
I will give you an undeniable, bomb-proof rationale why the Earth is flat.
Your job is to discuss why, in your Opinion, this is not the case.
Now we take this belief-item over to the Stones Forum and we'd better strap ourselves in - cuz it's gonna be a bumpy, bruising ride, with some clever, keen, and insightful reasons why your mother should never have swum out to that troopship.
Fair enough.
But in here it's already a given that this is an opinion, so why be redundant?
Anyway, that's my ...
Neil
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tiompan
Joined:
09-01-2005
Messages: 2658
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2013-02-06 09:42
Quote:
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On 2013-02-06 00:47, rogeralbin wrote:
Quote:
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On 2013-02-06 00:01, tiompan
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Proving a negative is not impossible but very difficult . You should also consider each case on it's merits , so far dowsers have failed to do any better than by chance and often fail entirely . There are plenty of recorded examples with some tests extensive and expensive . I have nothing to prove , it's not me who makes the unsupportable claims .
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My point exactly shifting the onus from your "prove it" perspective leaves you quoting tests that we have not had the abiliity to examine, that may well be anecdotal. Your claim that you have nothing to prove, is I suggest open to debate and the denial about unsurportable claims is dependant on the observer sharing your opinion of yourself that in this matter that: you are an honest broker without preconcieved opinion.
[/quote]
Whether in law , science or everyday disputes the burden of proof is on those making the extraordinary claims , any attempt to change that perspective i.e. shifting the burden of proof involves the logical fallacy of appealling to ignorance .
You can't disprove the existence of the tooth fairy , only in specific cases can it be shown not to have the been the cause of the phenomena . Being unaware of the numerous examples where dowsers have been tested and produced results no better than expected by chance does not make these tests anecdotal . Apart from these occasions on archaeology type progs where dowsers have been brought in and failed to find what they had claimed or on pop science progs like Randi and Alda more rigorous tests have been conducted and the results have been the same . Our opinions don't matter , it's the results that count. This is old hat and what I believe Rune is suggesting we move on from .
George
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rogeralbin
Joined:
08-10-2010
Messages: 195
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2013-02-06 00:47
Quote:
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On 2013-02-06 00:01, tiompan
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Proving a negative is not impossible but very difficult . You should also consider each case on it's merits , so far dowsers have failed to do any better than by chance and often fail entirely . There are plenty of recorded examples with some tests extensive and expensive . I have nothing to prove , it's not me who makes the unsupportable claims .
[/quote]
My point exactly shifting the onus from your "prove it" perspective leaves you quoting tests that we have not had the abiliity to examine, that may well be anecdotal. Your claim that you have nothing to prove, is I suggest open to debate and the denial about unsurportable claims is dependant on the observer sharing your opinion of yourself that in this matter that: you are an honest broker without preconcieved opinion.
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tiompan
Joined:
09-01-2005
Messages: 2658
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2013-02-06 00:01
Quote:
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On 2013-02-05 23:32, rogeralbin wrote:
Quote:
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On 2013-02-02 03:08, Runemage wrote:
Hi George,
I've written a very long and detailed reply which I've sent by pm as otherwise this thread could well fragment into a lot of tangents.
>I don’t believe any form of preface is needed to comments
I don’t either, but I do think we need some way of moving discussions on when a subject can be discussed for its own interests’ sake despite not being able to prove it.
>. Maybe I have misunderstood and we are not supposed to question anything down here and just blindly accept everything , in which case maybe there should be a mysteries section for the huge amount of real mysteries and another where a one can say what you like about your beliefs and never be questioned about them .
Not blindly accept at all but also hopefully not end up in the same old circular arguments.
All dowsing discussions on this forum follow the same pattern and we need to find a way to progress past the stalemate.
A. I found X using the rods.
B. Prove X exists
B. Prove you can find X
A. Recounts anecdote
B. I will only accept you can find X if you submit to a controlled test.
Result, any discussion of X is stifled and there’s bad feeling to boot.
This has been going on for years.
Here’s one suggestion re breaking the endless tedium.
Could we all accept that from this point in time on this forum :-
Everybody knows that dowsing is not scientifically proven and all examples provided are anecdote, not the dictionary definition of fact. Would that enable discussions to progress? If not, what could?
I'm asking for everyone's input here, what can we all do to move on?
Rune
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How about asking Tiompan to look in the other end of the telescope and prove dowsing does not work, he can then feel free to attach all his bells whistles and flags to his satisfaction and still be unable to prove to us that it does not, but at least we will have a change of perspective.
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Proving a negative is not impossible but very difficult . You should also consider each case on it's merits , so far dowsers have failed to do any better than by chance and often fail entirely . There are plenty of recorded examples with some tests extensive and expensive . I have nothing to prove , it's not me who makes the unsupportable claims .
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rogeralbin
Joined:
08-10-2010
Messages: 195
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2013-02-05 23:32
Quote:
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On 2013-02-02 03:08, Runemage wrote:
Hi George,
I've written a very long and detailed reply which I've sent by pm as otherwise this thread could well fragment into a lot of tangents.
>I don’t believe any form of preface is needed to comments
I don’t either, but I do think we need some way of moving discussions on when a subject can be discussed for its own interests’ sake despite not being able to prove it.
>. Maybe I have misunderstood and we are not supposed to question anything down here and just blindly accept everything , in which case maybe there should be a mysteries section for the huge amount of real mysteries and another where a one can say what you like about your beliefs and never be questioned about them .
Not blindly accept at all but also hopefully not end up in the same old circular arguments.
All dowsing discussions on this forum follow the same pattern and we need to find a way to progress past the stalemate.
A. I found X using the rods.
B. Prove X exists
B. Prove you can find X
A. Recounts anecdote
B. I will only accept you can find X if you submit to a controlled test.
Result, any discussion of X is stifled and there’s bad feeling to boot.
This has been going on for years.
Here’s one suggestion re breaking the endless tedium.
Could we all accept that from this point in time on this forum :-
Everybody knows that dowsing is not scientifically proven and all examples provided are anecdote, not the dictionary definition of fact. Would that enable discussions to progress? If not, what could?
I'm asking for everyone's input here, what can we all do to move on?
Rune
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How about asking Tiompan to look in the other end of the telescope and prove dowsing does not work, he can then feel free to attach all his bells whistles and flags to his satisfaction and still be unable to prove to us that it does not, but at least we will have a change of perspective.
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cerrig
Joined:
25-09-2009
Messages: 909
from Brecon Beacons
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2013-02-04 09:30
That Andy B bloke does unspeakeable things , just check out his last post. 
[ This message was edited by: cerrig on 2013-02-04 09:32 ]
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sem
Joined:
12-11-2003
Messages: 1710
from Bridgend,S.Wales
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2013-02-04 00:44
Basically you've got one bloke from Yorkshire (my birthplace) who now lives "down south" yet still claims to be a Yorkman in the comfort of these southern climes. The other is the epitomisation of AA Gill's "pugnacious troll" from Wales (my adopted home) who chooses to spend his time wandering the mountains in search of SHEEP!.
Check them out -
http://www.megalithic.co.uk/user.php?op=userinfo&uname=cropredy
http://www.megalithic.co.uk/user.php?op=userinfo&uname=cerrig
Personally I hate people doing unspeakable things to sheep.
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cerrig
Joined:
25-09-2009
Messages: 909
from Brecon Beacons
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2013-02-03 22:24
Quote:
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On 2013-02-03 21:07, Andy B wrote:
OK OK both of you, what is this - post modern meta ad hominem
Post hominem?
Very clever 
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What....?
I'd look up the meaning of that on the web, but I've banned myself from doing that, so I'll just take it as a compliment. If it's an insult it's probably meant for the other bloke anyway. 
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rogeralbin
Joined:
08-10-2010
Messages: 195
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2013-02-03 22:20
Sorry guys I hit the wrong key and erased half of this.
[ This message was edited by: rogeralbin on 2013-02-03 22:25 ]
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