Featured Title:
Pictures from the Past: Art and Symbols of the Neolithic and Bronze Age |
 |
| Stone Worlds: Narrative and Reflexivity in Landscape Archaeology |
 |
| Login |
|
Don't have an account yet? You can create one. As a registered user you have some advantages like your own home page, fewer ads, and your contributions link to your page. |
| Who's Online |
There are currently, 110 guests and 6 members online.
You are a guest. To join in, please register for free by clicking here |
| |
| Review your Reply |
tiompan
Joined:
09-01-2005
Messages: 2658
 OFF-Line
|  New Message Posted!2012-06-13 09:18
The Havelock -Fidler sites and those mentioned McIlmichall's account are , with one possible exception none are prehistoric monuments . For a variety of reasons people have forever associated features in the landscape with myth .In the early historic period it might be fairies , monsters or heroes in the mid 20th C it became ufo's or “energies “ Havelock -Fidler was reacting much the same as McIlmichall . It is an insight into their imagination , sadly we don't what went on in the imaginations of those in prehistory in relation to natural features in the landscape but it would have reflected their myths .When you press compare today the potential is immense it depends on the culture but all you get is an insight into that culture not that of prehistory .
George
|
vlad
Joined:
13-05-2006
Messages: 1292
from Stockholm
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2012-06-13 08:27
You can start with pondering travels of heroes in European mythologies. For Peloponnese, Greece, you have Herakles` travels and the track of Pelops between Asia Minor and Olympia. But in Ireland there are travels and marriages of Fionn McCumhaill, which are the finest example. Example for what? - Well; whatever comes to your mind with regard to dowsing. Just press button "compare" but I think the result will be - "function disabled"?
|
tiompan
Joined:
09-01-2005
Messages: 2658
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2012-06-12 20:56
Couldn't you supply examples of these personifications ,
from the western tradition , it would be difficult to do so from prehistory as there could be no record .
Ms Henderson certainly didn't mean that .
George
Quote:
On 2012-06-12 10:21, vlad wrote:
Personifications of life-energies circulating in Nature underwent cultural changes in the course of (pre)history. Yet the awareness of living beings`reactions to those energies of the environment hasn`t been lost in some societies (e.g. China) since the Stone Age down to our times.
Liz Henderson meant "maps of supernatural" clothed in those personifications, fastened to concrete spots of the environment.
Quote:
|
On 2012-06-12 20:29, vlad wrote:
Look e.g. into any scientifically well-commented Greek mythology and compare with Chinese traditions. The key-word is COMPARE. Good lecture and good night... oups; where does stand "compare", etc, etc...
[ This message was edited by: vlad on 2012-06-12 20:30 ]
|
|
Quote:
|
On 2012-06-12 19:58, vlad wrote:
Life-energies are consequently personified throughout the Western traditions. Using yin-yang system to analyze the latter is my own proposition, addressed at European dowsers. Are you one of them? If it`s not the case, then you cannot have any use of my explanations.
[ This message was edited by: vlad on 2012-06-12 20:26 ]
|
|
|
vlad
Joined:
13-05-2006
Messages: 1292
from Stockholm
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2012-06-12 20:29
Look e.g. into any scientifically well-commented Greek mythology and compare with Chinese traditions. The key-word is COMPARE. Good lecture and good night... oups; where does stand "compare", etc, etc...
[ This message was edited by: vlad on 2012-06-12 20:30 ]
|
tiompan
Joined:
09-01-2005
Messages: 2658
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2012-06-12 20:11
Where are the mentions of "life energies " in the western traditions ?
George
Quote:
|
On 2012-06-12 19:58, vlad wrote:
As I wrote many times before, life-energies are consequently personified throughout the Western traditions. Using yin-yang system to precisely pin down the latter within a landscape, in case of insecurity, - is my own proposition, addressed to European dowsers.
[ This message was edited by: vlad on 2012-06-12 20:05 ]
|
|
|
vlad
Joined:
13-05-2006
Messages: 1292
from Stockholm
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2012-06-12 19:58
Life-energies are consequently personified throughout the Western traditions. Using yin-yang system to analyze the latter is my own proposition, addressed at European dowsers. Are you one of them? If it`s not the case, then you cannot have any use of my explanations.
[ This message was edited by: vlad on 2012-06-12 20:26 ]
|
tiompan
Joined:
09-01-2005
Messages: 2658
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2012-06-12 17:01
Ms Henderson doesn’t mention “life energies “and there is no reason believe that is what she intended ,or indeed that was the sub text of McIlmichall's account . These concrete spots in the environment as noted by McIlmichall were all natural features e.g. sithean = fairy hills usually geological features like knolls or moraines . Prominent natural features are often named and explained by reference to folk tales and religion but I can’t think of one in the Gaeltachd or lowland Scots culture that refers to “energies “ .
George
Quote:
|
On 2012-06-12 10:21, vlad wrote:
Personifications of life-energies circulating in Nature underwent cultural changes in the course of (pre)history. Yet the awareness of living beings`reactions to those energies of the environment hasn`t been lost in some societies (e.g. China) since the Stone Age down to our times.
Liz Henderson meant "maps of supernatural" clothed in those personifications, fastened to concrete spots of the environment. Translating the personifications back into "life energies" is what one could learn one way or another and then verify, when walking a landscape.
BTW I think there`s no such thing like "supernatural". Into this category, many perfectly natural phenomena has been thrown, which are not understandable at first glance. As such, they offend our pride, or what?...
[ This message was edited by: vlad on 2012-06-12 15:52 ]
|
|
|
vlad
Joined:
13-05-2006
Messages: 1292
from Stockholm
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2012-06-12 10:21
Personifications of life-energies circulating in Nature underwent cultural changes in the course of (pre)history. Yet the awareness of living beings`reactions to those energies of the environment hasn`t been lost in some societies (e.g. China) since the Stone Age down to our times.
Liz Henderson meant "maps of supernatural" clothed in those personifications, fastened to concrete spots of the environment. Translating the personifications back into "life energies" is what one could learn one way or another and then verify, when walking a landscape.
BTW I think there`s no such thing like "supernatural". Into this category, many perfectly natural phenomena has been thrown, which are not understandable at first glance. As such, they offend our pride, or what?...
[ This message was edited by: vlad on 2012-06-12 15:52 ]
|
tiompan
Joined:
09-01-2005
Messages: 2658
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2012-06-12 09:57
Quote:
|
On 2012-06-12 07:46, vlad wrote:
P.S. Some time ago, I`ve found such a note at a blog :
- "Scottish folklorist Lizanne Henderson paraphrases seventeenth century Donald McIlmichall as saying that these beliefs are an "oral narrative map of a landscape touched everywhere by footprints of the supernatural". It`s a pity I couldn`t find more on that topic.
Maybe breaking a road through the wilderness in this direction could give some results as for the reasons why the ancient people - in cooperation with Nature, laid out those stone formations?
|
|
In the case of the Havelock -Fidler "sites" only one may have been "laid out " in prehistory .
What Ms Henderson was suggesting was that place names can give an insight into beliefs .This is undoubtedly true but the beliefs and names associated with many prehistoric sites are clearly historical and post christian which doesn't help much in relation to understanding the original beliefs of the builders . Myths and stories about the devil , fairies , Diarmid , Tam Lin , witches etc. tell us about the historic post christian view (and due to the recording process much of it in the modern period ,Mcilmichall in 1677 from a Court Session ) of the landscape , not that of the earlier inhabitants of that same landscape .
George
|
vlad
Joined:
13-05-2006
Messages: 1292
from Stockholm
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2012-06-12 07:46
P.S. Some time ago, I`ve found such a note at a blog :
- "Scottish folklorist Lizanne Henderson paraphrases seventeenth century Donald McIlmichall as saying that these beliefs are an "oral narrative map of a landscape touched everywhere by footprints of the supernatural". It`s a pity I couldn`t find more on that topic.
Maybe breaking a road through the wilderness in this direction could give some results as for the reasons why the ancient people - in cooperation with Nature, laid out those stone formations?
| |
|
Main News