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| Stonehenge: The Story So Far, Julian Richards |
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jonm
Joined:
12-07-2011
Messages: 815
from UK
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|  New Message Posted!2012-05-29 08:32
Hi Neil
I think it's likely. But how would you prove it? There will be lots of naysayers.
I also think that the neolithic stuff may be getting in the way of the explanation so I went looking for another location to do the initial photo set without having barrows to muddy the water.
Turns out there is one other place quite a few miles away where it can be done. Unfortunately there's also a barrow in the exact spot that I needed: I'd not noticed until this week just how commonplace barrows are.
Life
Jon
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vlad
Joined:
13-05-2006
Messages: 1283
from Stockholm
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| New Message Posted!2012-05-29 08:07
Thanks, Feanor. Just trying to keep mind open and to not forget the essentials. The latter one can find most easily within Mircea Eliade`s books. Therein, the basic rule for locating sanctuaries is talked about many times. Yeap; a sanctuary is the place within the human world (Midgard - Middle World), where the Heavens and the Underworld coincide.
You can also take a look into Rig-Veda on the net, to ponder Vedic views on characteristics of such places. The typical formula is Agni (heavenly fire) coming down to dive into "waters" (female life-energy?), wherefrom comes Soma. Rituals connected with Soma testify to its meaning as the base for all life.
As for Greek world-view, "soma" is sometimes equalled to the food of gods,i.e. nectar and ambrosia. A wider perspective on this point you can find in the book of Karl Kerenyi - "Dionysos: Archetypal Image of Indestructible Life"
http://www.amazon.com/Dionysos-Archetypal-Image-Indestructible-Life/dp/0691029156
In this book, Kerenyi is discussing the ancient concept of "zoe" (a "life-stream"?), contrasting it to "bios" - a life of an individual being. There are some books in the world, whose meaning one can enjoy to discover anew again and again, under one`s lifetime?
[ This message was edited by: vlad on 2012-05-29 11:38 ]
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cerrig
Joined:
25-09-2009
Messages: 907
from Brecon Beacons
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| New Message Posted!2012-05-28 23:43
Crazy Welshmen. Sem, you have "arrived". Welcome aboard, former saesneg. 
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sem
Joined:
12-11-2003
Messages: 1704
from Bridgend,S.Wales
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| New Message Posted!2012-05-28 22:28
Huuumph!
Sorry, just clearing my sheep's throat.
Sem
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Feanor
Joined:
11-05-2011
Messages: 316
from Cape Cod Massachusetts, US
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| New Message Posted!2012-05-28 22:15
Hi Vlad!
Gee ...
Whatever can the Stonehenge Trilithon Set resemble?
Why is it open to the Summer Solstice?
Why do opposing Stones in each set almost certainly represent Male & Female?
Why is ~51 degrees North (or south) the only place where the Solstices are 180 degrees apart?
Could it be ... (dare I say it) ... these people knew all about their version of Celestial Mechanics?
The Sky & Earth are forever entwined.
Love reading your posts, btw!
__________________
Hi Sem!
About that Satellite Dish ...
Further, if indirect, proof that the World is indeed Round!
Hee hee! I love you crazy Welshmen! The only people in the world (except the Finns) whose name for simple things sounds like someone with emphysema trying to clear their throat!
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sem
Joined:
12-11-2003
Messages: 1704
from Bridgend,S.Wales
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| New Message Posted!2012-05-28 21:27
You're obviously a sad person Feanor.
Anyone with a spark of intelligence would invest in a satellite TV dish and watch Eastenders/Coronation Street or whatever the US equivalent is.
Watching the sky indeed! What is the world coming to?
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vlad
Joined:
13-05-2006
Messages: 1283
from Stockholm
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| New Message Posted!2012-05-28 18:16
Yes; let`s build a receptacle for cosmic energies - our own local womb of the Mother Earth; out of these stones around. But how shall we know if it`s the proper location for a "womb"? Well; the Sun is the King and in the Spring he sends his Son - the Thunderer to pour his fiery semen into a right place within our grounds. Just wait and watch... or ask the Old Clever One.
[ This message was edited by: vlad on 2012-05-28 18:35 ]
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Feanor
Joined:
11-05-2011
Messages: 316
from Cape Cod Massachusetts, US
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| New Message Posted!2012-05-28 17:28
Venus has been a great deal of fun to watch this last 2-odd years, seeing it come from behind the sun and then spin around in our direction, only to melt back into the Day-Star again. The high azimuth has made it appear much brighter than in previous passages, and the recent conjunction with Jupiter was quite impressive.
Re: Jon's fun experiment, simplified.
Let's say I'm a Shepherd. My Dad was a Shepherd. My sons probably will be too. I drew the short straw so have to sit out there watching o're the flocks by night. As I have seen for many years the stellar dome rises in the east and passes overhead, traveling westward throughout the evening. The upper axis about which this eternal wheel spins is in the North. Very little movement there compared to the sweeping travel of patterns in the South, where the Lower Axis must be, below the horizon.
As the weeks and months go by I see different patterns rise earlier in the evening, and as the seasons move along I detect that each season has a dominant set of stars in the sky at a similar time at night.
Clearly these stars, relative to each other, are stationary. But because of their movement en masse, the whole sky is most certainly in orbit around the earth.
Now I see the Moon. It goes through its monthly phases but is obviously in its natural state when it's full. That would be round.
The Sun, seen through dense cloud cover, is not only round, but it's also the same size as the Moon.
Now lemme see here ... the Moon & Sun are round, they're the same size and they follow a pattern across the sky through a zone determined by the time of year. The stars are obviously farther away because the don't move relative to each other, yet still parade across the sky in their ageless patterns and every year at the same time they wind up in the same spot.
Even those 4 or 5 'Wanderers' seem to follow this imaginary zone in their quirky passages.
But they all seem to use our North as a pivot-point.
Hey! The earth must be round too - and everything in the Universe orbits us!
We must be Very Special in the Cosmic Scheme of Things!
Let's Build Something!
[ This message was edited by: Feanor on 2012-05-28 23:42 ]
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jonm
Joined:
12-07-2011
Messages: 815
from UK
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| New Message Posted!2012-05-28 09:33
Hi Rune
Experiment worked but I've also found that in this location you can also show how big the earth is using the same arrangement (but I have to wait to photograph the experiment at two solstices to prove to a "reviewable" standard that it does work)
The odd thing is that you would predict that such an easy experiment would fail according to the simplified explanations that you get in various astro-archaeo textbooks: This means that the text accompanying the experiment has to go into a great detail or it'll get criticised (rubbished) by anyone checking against the simplified texts.
Sunset was just as beautiful as sunrise on the day: Orange sky in morning but a red sky at night:
Jon
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Runemage
Joined:
15-07-2005
Messages: 2412
from UK
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| New Message Posted!2012-05-23 16:08
I think Jon's reply from the' New ebook from Neil L Thomas:Stonehenge' thread is also very relevant here:-
Posted 23-05-2012 at 10:47 "It's easy to see coincidences where there are none. Nevertheless, you've got to keep an open mind?
On weird coincidences, I've been looking at how you would go about proving that the earth is a sphere using a form of cardinal layout if you didn't have modern resources, so came up with a low-tech surveying experiment with the idea of photographing how it might be done. There's only one place in the local area where the surrounding topography could work so I went to take a look yesterday afternoon.
On arriving, there was a barrow at exactly the correct position, layout and diameter needed for the experiment, so I won't need to hike up as much kit as originally thought. Even better, there's one other barrow on the horizon at the correct azimuth to act as the primary reference marker. This experiment doesn't need maths because you can draw it out on the ground. Luckily, there also seems to be a suitable set of earthworks (a form of circular enclosure) adjacent to my newly found primary reference marker (I was going to use a tree and tie a yellow jacket to it).
Whatever these coincidences mean, they will make the experiment a lot easier to do.
Jon "
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