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Forum: Stones Forum
Moderated by : Andy B , TimPrevett , coldrum , Klingon , MickM , TheCaptain , bat400 , davidmorgan , Runemage , SolarMegalith , sem
Respond to: Is there any way if this......
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sem
Joined:
12-11-2003
Messages: 1722
from Bridgend,S.Wales
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|  New Message Posted!2012-09-14 11:29
Yes Jim
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Dragonsinger
Joined:
09-05-2012
Messages: 21
from Bradford
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| New Message Posted!2012-09-14 10:49
Hi Sem
OK point taken.
But is the scenario valid?
Regards
Jim
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sem
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12-11-2003
Messages: 1722
from Bridgend,S.Wales
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| New Message Posted!2012-09-13 21:19
Hi Jim
It doesn't have to be an apprentice making the mistake. Most chunks of stone have internal weaknesses that can only be estimated by looking at the exterior. Maybe it's just a case of pass another stone the last one split - a very old and (depending on the subject) rude joke.
Best wishes
Sem
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Dragonsinger
Joined:
09-05-2012
Messages: 21
from Bradford
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| New Message Posted!2012-09-13 19:39
Oh come on guys.
Picture this:
Ancient Brit monument builder and apprentice.
Wooden wedge driven in along the bedding plane. CRACK!! Right either we need more wedges or... Hang on a mo, bung that lump of rock in there.
Great! Let's do that again, and again, and.. OH $%&^"!I dropped the hammerstone on my foot. I'm going for a lie down.
OK it's a fantasy
Mabey.
Regards
Jim
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Landsker_man
Joined:
11-12-2011
Messages: 49
from Pembrokeshire
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| New Message Posted!2012-05-24 06:45
Quote:
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On 2012-05-23 22:04, sem wrote:
..or a log of wood inserted into the split after the stone wedge, and you then hit this with the hammer?
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Yes!! Never thought of that one....that could certainly explain the depth of the wedge....like we would use a center punch to drive a nail into wood today......
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sem
Joined:
12-11-2003
Messages: 1722
from Bridgend,S.Wales
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| New Message Posted!2012-05-23 22:04
..or a log of wood inserted into the split after the stone wedge, and you then hit this with the hammer?
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Landsker_man
Joined:
11-12-2011
Messages: 49
from Pembrokeshire
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| New Message Posted!2012-05-23 21:36
Hi Sem
Wow interesting indeed,Im going to have a look for this stone also ....
Im going to go back on my next walk and get some clearer photos of the lichen and lateral split on the stone ,which looks "newer" than the main split. I just hope it is not some modern crank who has done this intending for the lichen to grow back so it could not be dated easily, I have one doubt over the stone I found and that is the depth the wedge stone is inside the body of the main stone,it would be rather difficult and awkward to have hit that in there,given the low position of the stone without a modern heavy hammer to swing with I fear but even that would not be easy given the angle to work with... Perhaps some modern archaeologists have been "experimenting with technique" deciding to leave it there to be discovered later by someone when the lichen has hopefully covered the wedges path....
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Landsker_man
Joined:
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Messages: 49
from Pembrokeshire
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| New Message Posted!2012-05-23 21:15
Quote:
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On 2012-05-22 02:22, Feanor wrote:
Hi Hugh, Neil here.
With regard to the top few pics ...
I cannot tell if the slab is still whole beneath its longitudinal split. If so perhaps they were attempting to shiver it down the middle?
The lichens tell a story here as well. They are prevalent on the main chunk, and likewise on the shim (or wedge) used between the halves.
Though this flora is difficult to 'date' as it were, the various types have a known life-span and its previous layers are usually in evidence. Therefore it could tell us if the work is more than 500 years old, for example, rather than 20.
I mention this only because, as shown in the photos, the transverse break appears to be fresh. If there are similar lichens on the interior of these 2 faces perhaps a case could be made for the stone's abandonment at the time of the work.
(Let's blame an exuberant, inexperienced apprentice, driving a large wedge to fast!)
For what it's worth, I am with Sem & FC42 in terms of the probability of Human Action.
The fact that its location is well off the beaten track is also a nudge toward the prehistoric.
Is there evidence of any working elsewhere on the stone?
(It looks unnaturally rounded)
Do other stones in the vicinity show the work of hand?
Is the dolerite in the area a known source of the SH Bluestones?
I would be interested in any follow-up on your investigations.
Well done.
Best wishes,
Neil
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Hi Neil
I agree this has to have been done by Human hand there is no question,but its the age that needs to be reckoned . As you rightly say it seems to be the Lichen has been disturbed "in the wake" of the wedges path and although it has begun to grow back it needs to be estimated as to how old this break is. I know of someone who is a qualified botanist whom I will be supplying a disc of photos and maybe a "cutting" of the Lichen to estimate the growth rates. I also intend to go back there very soon to try to get answers to the list of questions i have been asked regarding this stone.
I am willing to let you know the stone is actually closer than i originally quoted it is in fact within a few hundred yards of the Carn Menyn"bluestone" outcrops" and yes there is another stone I have spotted that appears to have work done along an edge....
By landsker_man at 2012-05-23
By landsker_man at 2012-05-23
By landsker_man at 2012-05-23
This stone looked like it has been "propped" here in this position and work done along this "sharp" edge,all the other stones do not appear to present such sharp edges,I believe this stone has been modified.
I will post here any further findings when i return to the site
All the very best
Hugh
[ This message was edited by: Landsker_man on 2012-05-23 21:18 ]
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Landsker_man
Joined:
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Messages: 49
from Pembrokeshire
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| New Message Posted!2012-05-23 20:59
Quote:
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On 2012-05-20 22:27, frogcottage42 wrote:
If it was a stone that was being split but snapped the chock stone or wedge would need to be much smaller because you would not be able to drive that one in. So; either it was split and then that stone was placed there prior to some further use that has never been carried out or it was wedged like that ready for lifting and was never moved. either way it seems near impossible that this was not deliberate human action but there is no way to date it.
Just one of those curio's that only the chap who did it could answer. Without which this site would not exist!
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Hi frogcottage42
Yes I agree the the wedge would need to be a little slimmer in order to get a balanced, clean more controlled break,it must have been rather difficult trying to pound that wedge into there. Imagine this though,an ambitious slightly less experienced stone splitter,maybe a youngster "having a go" not listening to his teacher decides to carry on because he thinks knows better,breaks the stone then in his moment of anger when he realises he should have listened gives it a couple of almighty whacks in frustration? Sound familiar? I think we have all been there....
All the best
Hugh
[ This message was edited by: Landsker_man on 2012-05-23 21:16 ]
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sem
Joined:
12-11-2003
Messages: 1722
from Bridgend,S.Wales
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| New Message Posted!2012-05-22 11:38
Here's the link
http://www.megalithic.co.uk/modules.php?op=modload&name=a312&file=index&do=showpic&pid=89375
Thanks whoever modded this like lightening.
Sem
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