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ledgehammer
Joined:
29-06-2011
Messages: 747
from Surrey
 OFF-Line
|  New Message Posted!2011-10-30 18:00
Quote:
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On 2011-10-30 15:44, frogcottage42 wrote:
Hi all, cheers for your replies.
With regard to science I simply mean the established process of experimentation with a view to achieving repeatable results.
I do not suggest that this is a panacea for establishing good data but merely a starting point.
Thinking for oneself is another starting point but to try to embrace the meaning behind the actions of others ( including building megalithic structures) I suspect something more akin to collective intellect is needed.
My point about bickering on these fora was not meant as a criticism but an observation and as Tom says I guess that is how things are done at the moment.
The reason I ask about trying blind map dowsing is that if there is a structure to the universe which can be tapped into by our subconscious and interacted with then perhaps it would be manifested this way, a bit like the scrabble letters in The HH Guide T T U.
The link to this thread is that if there is an underlying structure then all geometry must be in some way interconnected and the builders of ancient sites may have had a blanker canvass than we have to draw upon.
Perhaps decluttering our field of view will allow better vision of their underlying purposes.
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F.C
I Hear ya,
in reference to blind map dowsing I am not the best person to qualify as my experience is not sufficient to explain this, but I believe it quite possible that our current conciousness is a part of a much larger conciousness, wether that is the real me, or that we are all binded by a collective conciousness I am not sure, therefore the answers come from either the real us, or a higher level of conciousness.
I consider the possibilty that there may be another part to the universe we cannot directly access at present, my avatar refers to di-vincis idea about this (the circular part of the logo), we exist in this world as well but there is no linear time as such and is impossible to comprehend. N.D.E's and conciousness experimentation could help to explain similarities between subjects on this front but there is much work to be done before full conclusions can be drawn.
Dowsing would be us sending out a signal, x receiving it, sending the signal back, and us translating it through subtle variations in our hands and or other methods. I base this on dowsers seemingly being able to detect to a good degree of accuracy answers to questions, I prefer using rods to locate my target and personally dont like to ask too many questions party because I do not fully understand the source of the answers. Dowsing is all about confidence and we seem to be an integral part of it, I believe it to be very possible to get a high degree of accuracy, but the deeper you go questions about the purpose of your dowsing become key, and I think the motivations would change.
They call me tangent Tom and now you know why, back to the thread, the geometry of the earth including things like ley lines, energy lines, water lines seem to be detectable at these sites, naturally this alone does not mean that there is anything unusual, but when the corners of a standing stone each mark a water line and a group of stones mark an energy ley to a precise degree one could only dismiss this as subconcious trickery or that the sites were in some way built to mark this, use this, or create this. A true sceptic could deny everything down to ones senses, the colour of a wall, or the existance of light it depends how far you are willing to go. Many dowsers find different geometries, different things, which leaves it open for scepticalisiation, but there are similarities and patterns found between different dowsers and as explained above if we are an integral part of the dowsing process there will be differences and similarities.
Some have explained to me that the ancients saw all of this very clearly, as you mentioned we have become cluttered and our motivations are different so in may ways our perception would also be different , this is why it is difficult to assign purpose to these sites, consider now life is in great abundance in those times preserving the tribe e.t.c would have been paramount and was a different thing, perhaps the geometries of these sites was in mind of this, to preserve life, improve fertility, crop yeild e.t.c using the Earths natural vibrations / energy lines.
We now look to electricity, machines and other methods that have increased with our species evolution, technological breakthroughs pave the way for science today rather than the journey within oneself, this has its pros and cons but relying so heavilly on electrical energy may have its dowsfalls in the future.
Tom
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frogcottage42
Joined:
14-02-2010
Messages: 235
from tuosist
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2011-10-30 15:44
Hi all, cheers for your replies.
With regard to science I simply mean the established process of experimentation with a view to achieving repeatable results.
I do not suggest that this is a panacea for establishing good data but merely a starting point.
Thinking for oneself is another starting point but to try to embrace the meaning behind the actions of others ( including building megalithic structures) I suspect something more akin to collective intellect is needed.
My point about bickering on these fora was not meant as a criticism but an observation and as Tom says I guess that is how things are done at the moment.
The reason I ask about trying blind map dowsing is that if there is a structure to the universe which can be tapped into by our subconscious and interacted with then perhaps it would be manifested this way, a bit like the scrabble letters in The HH Guide T T U.
The link to this thread is that if there is an underlying structure then all geometry must be in some way interconnected and the builders of ancient sites may have had a blanker canvass than we have to draw upon.
Perhaps decluttering our field of view will allow better vision of their underlying purposes.
|
cropredy
Joined:
01-01-2006
Messages: 5599
from Oxon
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2011-10-28 21:28
Quote:
|
On 2011-10-28 13:42, frogcottage42 wrote:
When I first looked at stuff on this forum I was fairly dismayed but not necessarily surprised by the amount of personal mudslinging and general bickering that goes on.
It is interesting to see how resistant to alternative opinions people can be.
I for one analyse everything in a scientific manner and then temper my conclusions with the premise that nothing is proven and nothing exists or is a fact beyond ones personal belief or opinion.
If something works for one person then great, if it works for several then even better but that does not constitute irrefutable evidence that it is either the correct or only point of view.
When reading though the passion, intransigence and obvious belief written in these fora it is of little wonder that human history is often defined by major conflict.
I would like to believe that we may have come somewhere more enlightened on our evolutionary journey through history but reading through pages of similar disputes leads me to suspect otherwise.
To get slightly nearer the thread I have kind of ignored so far, has anyone seriously tried map dowsing over maps that are totally hidden beneath an opaque material so that any determinations are without visual stimuli?
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The ability to think of a very specific occurance, and attune to that is the basic of dowsing , imho.
To achieve this takes constant practise , and a realisation that universe is a kind of solid.
Thus every point is in direct contact with all other points.
http://www.coastproductdesign.com/solid_universe.html
I consider tht this solid( clear as glass) universe has a measurable scalar formation, basically a matrix.
Is Your "scientific manner"
simply that which You have been indoctrinated to accept, or do You think for Yourself?
cropredy
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Runemage
Joined:
15-07-2005
Messages: 2425
from UK
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2011-10-28 20:43
Good to see you 
When I first looked at stuff on this forum I was fairly dismayed but not necessarily surprised by the amount of personal mudslinging and general bickering that goes on.
Believe it or not, the general tone has improved greatly to what it was. I'd ask if anyone's at all bothered about it, then to say so, don't suffer in silence.
If we've not picked up on it immediately, then please pm Andy, Sem or myself and we'll sort it out. The pm suggestion is to avoid moderation issues cluttering up or derailing any particular threads.
It is interesting to see how resistant to alternative opinions people can be.
Not just in this field, it's in all walks of life. There is, for want of a better term, The Party Line and anything outside that is not only not countenanced, it's stomped into the ground and heaped with scorn and ridicule. It's the latter part, that behaviour, which despite trying for many years, I will never understand.
To get slightly nearer the thread I have kind of ignored so far, has anyone seriously tried map dowsing over maps that are totally hidden beneath an opaque material so that any determinations are without visual stimuli?
Not as far as I know, but the whole map dowsing thing is in doubt as no-one here is an experienced practitioner. All ideas gratefully received over here,
http://www.megalithic.co.uk/modules.php?op=modload&name=Forum&file=viewtopic&topic=4851&forum=4&start=20
Rune
Quote:
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On 2011-10-28 13:42, frogcottage42 wrote:
I for one analyse everything in a scientific manner and then temper my conclusions with the premise that nothing is proven and nothing exists or is a fact beyond ones personal belief or opinion.
If something works for one person then great, if it works for several then even better but that does not constitute irrefutable evidence that it is either the correct or only point of view.
When reading though the passion, intransigence and obvious belief written in these fora it is of little wonder that human history is often defined by major conflict.
I would like to believe that we may have come somewhere more enlightened on our evolutionary journey through history but reading through pages of similar disputes leads me to suspect otherwise.
To get slightly nearer the thread I have kind of ignored so far, has anyone seriously tried map dowsing over maps that are totally hidden beneath an opaque material so that any determinations are without visual stimuli?
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ledgehammer
Joined:
29-06-2011
Messages: 747
from Surrey
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2011-10-28 20:19
Quote:
|
On 2011-10-28 13:42, frogcottage42 wrote:
When I first looked at stuff on this forum I was fairly dismayed but not necessarily surprised by the amount of personal mudslinging and general bickering that goes on.
It is interesting to see how resistant to alternative opinions people can be.
I for one analyse everything in a scientific manner and then temper my conclusions with the premise that nothing is proven and nothing exists or is a fact beyond ones personal belief or opinion.
If something works for one person then great, if it works for several then even better but that does not constitute irrefutable evidence that it is either the correct or only point of view.
When reading though the passion, intransigence and obvious belief written in these fora it is of little wonder that human history is often defined by major conflict.
I would like to believe that we may have come somewhere more enlightened on our evolutionary journey through history but reading through pages of similar disputes leads me to suspect otherwise.
To get slightly nearer the thread I have kind of ignored so far, has anyone seriously tried map dowsing over maps that are totally hidden beneath an opaque material so that any determinations are without visual stimuli?
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Frogcottage,
interesting name, define what you refer to when you use the word science please.
In terms of mudslinging, e.t.c I have to admit I am prone to a little mudslinging, but it is at the postition one adopts and not towards the person, so I wouldn't call it "conflict" as such but can appreciate how it looks.
I for one have the upmost respect for all of the others on here, and without sceptical and alternative viewpoints "science" as you call it would not evolve, unfortunatly our species evolves through this process, and I hate to admit this but currently it is the way things are done, one has to just watch Prime ministers questions to feel this in its most immature manifestation.
The thread is entitled Geometry of ancient sites but to answer your question if you understand the basis of how map dowsing can work then having a clear map would be perhaps no use, not because of visual deception but for a reference, however if you were to ask using coordinates then this should work in theory.
The thread designated towards a map dowsing experiment can be found here :
Randi and Dowsing
I think the result is compelling but as any experiment even designed by sceptics Michael found the answer, and still sceptics wouldnt have it, I think the point of doing such experiments to proove to sceptics that it works is worthless, it is however fun
My problem with science is that it relies on experimentation, and reading instruments. Consider that our instruments are not able to detect everything, and consider that there may be much more that we do not know, I have to then consider that it is very possible that there may be many things that we are missing and if human senses can detect other things that science and our instruments can not and that other people can detect the same things and ancient sites are constructed in such a way that they compliment underground water and other things that people can detect.
I am not blind nor convinced of these things but am open to accepting that they may be so, I think one has to draw their own conclusions and there seems to be two very extreme sides an unscientific sceptical side and a blind non methodical side, incidently what I refer to as true scientists are able to engage both parts of the brain, i.e the inventive and methodical. But I repeat I am no expert 
Best wishes
Tom
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ledgehammer
Joined:
29-06-2011
Messages: 747
from Surrey
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2011-10-28 19:42
Quote:
|
On 2011-10-27 20:22, cropredy wrote:
Tom ,
Cheers, I had already found it here.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ledgehammer/
I had a wonderfull day today, on Ledgehammers keep fit tours
Shame You didn't photo the giant magic mushroom We found.
The tree with the spiral bark was amazing, and Rune would love the water from the spring...fabulous.
There's lot's of magical content in those woods and hills....lots.
cropredy
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Kev,
Its the first time Ive been in those woods in Autumn...
I will get a picture of the mushroom
Yes the ledgehammer keep fit tours will continue 
however it is your turn I believe now!!
Tom
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frogcottage42
Joined:
14-02-2010
Messages: 235
from tuosist
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2011-10-28 13:42
When I first looked at stuff on this forum I was fairly dismayed but not necessarily surprised by the amount of personal mudslinging and general bickering that goes on.
It is interesting to see how resistant to alternative opinions people can be.
I for one analyse everything in a scientific manner and then temper my conclusions with the premise that nothing is proven and nothing exists or is a fact beyond ones personal belief or opinion.
If something works for one person then great, if it works for several then even better but that does not constitute irrefutable evidence that it is either the correct or only point of view.
When reading though the passion, intransigence and obvious belief written in these fora it is of little wonder that human history is often defined by major conflict.
I would like to believe that we may have come somewhere more enlightened on our evolutionary journey through history but reading through pages of similar disputes leads me to suspect otherwise.
To get slightly nearer the thread I have kind of ignored so far, has anyone seriously tried map dowsing over maps that are totally hidden beneath an opaque material so that any determinations are without visual stimuli?
|
cropredy
Joined:
01-01-2006
Messages: 5599
from Oxon
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2011-10-27 20:22
Tom ,
Cheers, I had already found it here.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ledgehammer/
I had a wonderfull day today, on Ledgehammers keep fit tours
Shame You didn't photo the giant magic mushroom We found.
The tree with the spiral bark was amazing, and Rune would love the water from the spring...fabulous.
There's lot's of magical content in those woods and hills....lots.
cropredy
|
ledgehammer
Joined:
29-06-2011
Messages: 747
from Surrey
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2011-10-27 19:25
Kev...
try again:
Link to photo
Tom
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ledgehammer
Joined:
29-06-2011
Messages: 747
from Surrey
OFF-Line
| New Message Posted!2011-10-27 18:47
Kev:
as promised
Tom
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